Canine Reproduction
With Dr. Robert Hutchison
Transcript
A Chat Week Event
 As part of PetHobbyist.com's annual Chat Week, DogHobbyist.com is proud that leading canine reproduction expert Dr. Robert Hutchison was our special guest at a canine reproduction chat on Sunday, December 8, 2002 at 8 PM Eastern. The transcript of that chat follows.
Dr. Hutch is one of the country's most in-demand speakers at national specialties, dog club events, and anywhere breeders go to hear the latest information on dog breeding. His vast knowledge, warm approach, and sense of humor have made him a legend among dog fanciers. We thank him for helping make DogHobbyist.com's 4th Annual Chat Week such a huge success!
We hope you enjoy this transcript as much as we enjoyed the chat! And please be sure to join us every Friday evening from 9-10 PM Eastern in our Dog Breeders Chat, and drop by our Dog Breeding Forum, too!
Transcript
PHFasDog: Hello and welcome to the first night of PetHobbyist.com's Fourth Annual Chat Week!
PHFasDog: I'm PHFasDog, site coordinator of DogHobbyist.com.
PHFasDog: We are extremely happy to see you all here tonight and to welcome our very special guest, canine reproduction expert Dr. Robert Hutchison.
DrHutch: Thank you! glad to be here!
PHFasDog: Before I introduce Dr. Hutch, I just wanted to go over the protocol for the chat.
PHFasDog: No one is able to chat in the room right now, except the hosts and the guest. If you have a question for Dr. Hutch, you must do a few things:
PHFasDog: One, if you have not already done so, you must create a nickname. If you entered the room through the direct link (the java link), then you need to simply type the nickname you want in the space where you normally type chat, and then hit "enter."
PHFasDog: Use a name that is unique, as common names like "Sue" or "DogLover" are already registered to other users.
PHFasDog: If the name you use is already taken, or you are here using mIRC or another IRC client, you create a nickname this way:
PHFasDog: Type into the room the following text, and then hit enter when you are done: /nick desirednewname
PHFasDog: Then, simply doubleclick on the name AskDrHutch: in the right hand column, and then type your question into the small space at the bottom of the window that will appear, then hit "enter" to send it.
PHFasDog: If you have trouble or need to be reminded how this works, just doubleclick on my name or the name of any other host with @PH in front of their name, and we will help you!
PHFasDog: Before we start, I'd also like to introduce the president and CEO of the company that owns PetHobbyist.com, and creator of Chat Week, Jeff Barringer! He is here using the name jeffb: . :)
jeffb: hello
DrHutch: Thanks for having me, Jeff!
jeffb: Thank you for coming
jeffb: I hope everyone enjoys chat week
PHFasDog: We'd like to extend a special welcome also to Karen Copley, owner and founder of our sponsor, Veterinary Perinatal Specialties at http://www.whelpwise.com! Thanks for helping make this event possible, Karen!
PHFasDog: Now on behalf of all of us at DogHobbyist.com, I'd like to introduce Dr. Robert Hutchison!
PHFasDog: Dr. Hutchison is one of the country's top canine reproduction experts, and a popular speaker at specialties and other dog events. It's a great honor for us to welcome him here tonight.
DrHutch: Thank you everyone for spending a Sunday evening discussing canine reproduction and puppy care.
DrHutch: I feel (and look) like a jolly old elf with my holiday bag filled with wonderful gifts for the canine breeder. Mibolerone (formerly Chequedrops) are available again, we have Cabergoline for estrous cycle induction and and have now added laparoscopic surgical ai's and transcervical inseminations to our breeding arsenals. What a super way to end 2002 and start 2003!!
DrHutch: I guess I'll go ahead with your questions!
Question: Progesterone
DrHutch: I'm amazed at looking at the questions that were posted on the board, how much misunderstanding of progesterone there is
DrHutch: both by breeders and by veterinarians
PHFasDog: To ask a question, just click on "AskDrHutch: " in the right hand column, type your question, and hit "enter."
DrHutch: In this day and age, with the importance of progesterone, it's amazing how people misunderstand the significance of progesterone both on timing the ovulation
DrHutch: and on maintaining the pregnancy
DrHutch: in a perfect world the progesterone rises to 2-3 nanograms and tells the brain that the follicle is ripe and ready to ovulate and then the
DrHutch: brain releases the lutenizing hormone, the LH, which causes ovulation
DrHutch: unfortunately we were told that you only needed to know when it rose to 2-3 nanograms
DrHutch: unfortunately we were told that you only needed to know when it rose to 2-3 nanograms
DrHutch: which used to be called the initial rise
DrHutch: we have now found that not all follicles especially in bitches under stress, immediately respond to the LH
DrHutch: so for progesterone testing to mean anything one has to test their bitch until she goes above 5 nanograms
DrHutch: the day the progesterone rises above 5 nanograms IS the day of ovulation
DrHutch: so all breeding is based on the day of ovulation
DrHutch: and how long we expect the semen to live
DrHutch: fresh semen will live 5, 6, 7 days in a bitch
DrHutch: that's why we used to be able to breed by vaginal smears, color of the discharge, and day of the cycle
DrHutch: things that made us feel scientific but probably mattered very little
DrHutch: so once the egg is ovulated it is an immature egg
DrHutch: that takes 48 hours to mature
DrHutch: then we have about 36 hours when the egg is fertilizable
DrHutch: so if we're using fresh semen, we can breed the day of, or the day after, she ovulates and expect
DrHutch: the semen to live until the egg is ready to be fertilized
DrHutch: however with frozen semen which only lives for about 12 hours in the uterus
DrHutch: we have to use it when the egg IS ready for fertilization
DrHutch: which is why we breed 72 hours after the bitch ovulates with frozen semen
DrHutch: fresh cooled probably lives about 48 hours, so we use it 2 days after she ovulates
DrHutch: so the timing is based more on how long we expect the semen to live, rather than the day of ovulation
Question: How high should a bitch maintain her progesterone to remain pregnant? At what intervals should it be tested so you are sure it is high enough during the pregnancy?
DrHutch: Once the bitch ovulates, the progesterone rises to a range of 15-40 nanograms and is maintained here for the next two months
DrHutch: whether the bitch is pregnant or not
DrHutch: in the bitch, unlike the cat, the ovary is the sole source of progesterone
DrHutch: the bitch doesn't change part of the progesterone responsibility to the placenta
PHFasDog: If you have trouble or need to be reminded how this works, just doubleclick on my name or the name of any other host with @PH in front of their name, and we will help you!
DrHutch: so a premature drop of progesterone causing resorption or abortion is rare
DrHutch: so a bitch only needs 2.5 nanograms of progesterone to maintain a pregnancy
DrHutch: If one suspects a problem, usually testing it at ultrasound time, around 26 days after a breeding, is a good time to make sure the progesterone is in the 20-30 nanogram range
DrHutch: It will cause birth defects in bitch puppies to give progesterone if it's not needed
DrHutch: I only supplement if the progesterone is below 5 nanograms with longer than 7 days to go
DrHutch: OK, next question is: Are there any measures to be used to prevent resorption?
DrHutch: The main thing in resorption is to confirm that they were pregnant
DrHutch: just because a bitch goes into a false pregnancy does not mean she was ever pregnant
DrHutch: things that cause resporption are one, uterine lining problems
DrHutch: the uterus not able to support the placenta
DrHutch: number 2, genetic problems in the fetus stopping it from growing
DrHutch: three, some different infections and viruses
DrHutch: herpes has been blamed, brucellosis
DrHutch: there are some chemicals and toxins that will cause it
DrHutch: and probably lowest on the list is premature drop in progesterone
DrHutch: it does seem as a BREED that the English Mastiff does have a higher rate of bitches
DrHutch: that prematurely drop their progesterone
DrHutch: it is thought that many bitches that do prematurely drop their progesterone, it may be a primary immune mediated problem rather than an ovarian failure
Question: Can a maiden dog/bitch be carriers of brucellosis? If this is true, is there any way of testing them as a puppy for this?
DrHutch: YES!
DrHutch: Brucellosis can be passed in all body discharges including
DrHutch: urine, blood, milk, prostatic fluid, vaginal discharge
DrHutch: so if a male or female has been to a show, a field trial, a boarding kennel
DrHutch: they possibly have been exposed to brucellosis
DrHutch: most of the human cases of canine brucellosis have been from contamination of infected urine
DrHutch: so it is a fallacy that brucellosis is only passed during breeding
DrHutch: you should test for it within the month of when you expect your bitch to come in season
DrHutch: and males should be tested at least twice a year even if they're only bred to negative females
DrHutch: you can easily screen the other dogs
DrHutch: the main thing is to test dogs BEFORE they are introduced into your kennel
DrHutch: most of my experience of kennels with problems is where they brought in untested dogs who contaminated everyone
DrHutch: numberous dogs had incurable disease and had to be euthanized.
PHFasDog: If you have a question for Dr Hutch, just double click on the "AskDrHutch: " in the right hand column, type it into the space at the bottom, and then hit "enter!"
DrHutch: because the test in the veterinarian's office is not made from dog brucella
DrHutch: 20 percent can come up not negative, or a false positive
DrHutch: and would require further testing that can take up to three weeks to get the results
DrHutch: SO DON'T WAIT UNTIL THE LAST MINUTE!
A question on male fertility: When you have two bitches in season at the same time that need to be bred to the same male, what would be the optimum breeding intervals to cover both?
DrHutch: A normal male has a sperm reserve of semen he made months ago, so the average male could be used twice in one day
DrHutch: or could be used 4-5 days in a row without doing any damage
DrHutch: but since it takes a male around 55 days to make a sperm cell
DrHutch: if you overuse your male, you are putting yourself out of breeding commission for a minimum of 2-3 months
DrHutch: there is no reason to be breeding a bitch 5, 6, 7 days in a row
DrHutch: because the length of semen life is multiple days, and with progesterone testing
DrHutch: we should be able to pinpoint exactly when the bitch is ready to be bred
Question: Hi Hutch, nice to talk to you again. I have a 5 1/2 year old Weim bitch that you did a frozen semen implant on 2 years ago (produced 8 bouncing babies). Her heat cycles have been normal since the delivery (had to do the last baby via c-section) until this year. She came into heat in June and it only lasted 6 days. Thyroid tests normal range, blood workup normal ranges. What might have caused her to stop mid-heat back in June? She's in heat again now and I'm waiting to see if it's full cycle.
DrHutch: I LOVE these success questions!
DrHutch: in any heat cycle that one is concerned whether it's a normal cycle or not, ALWAYS do a progesterone test after the cycle to see if the bitch ovulated or not
DrHutch: if she did NOT ovlulate, which may account for the short cycle, a number of things such as stress, ovarian cysts, or environmental changes can cause a bitch to go back out of season
DrHutch: but only the progesterone test would allow us to know
DrHutch: so THIS cycle
DrHutch: if we are going to breed we need to start running progesterone tests at about day 6
DrHutch: and then run them every third day until we confirm ovulation and hence breed her
DrHutch: OR if the progesterone does not rise and she goes out of season
DrHutch: then we should be doing things like ultrasounding the ovaries
DrHutch: and looking for reasons that are preventing ovulation
Question: Do you know if mibolerone is available again in the USA? And, if so, is it as safe (or not) as the previous 'Cheque Drops'? Any contraindications or cautions in using it? Thanks!
DrHutch: I feel like Christmas has already come!
DrHutch: mibolerone is back on the market since August
DrHutch: it is the SAME volume and same concentration as the old Cheque drops even
DrHutch: though it is made by a different company
DrHutch: the price has gone up signifigantly
DrHutch: so I am recommending for dosing to start the bitch daily for ten days
DrHutch: and then go every other day
DrHutch: as a standard dose
DrHutch: be sure that the bitch has had her first cycle before starting on them
DrHutch: and I ALWAYS recommend having an ALT, which is a liver enzyme test, to be sure there is no liver disease, before I start on the drug
DrHutch: it is still one of the most valuable drugs available to preserve the uterine lining from the damage of progesterone from the bitch's own heat cycle
Question: Where can we obtain mibolerone?
DrHutch: a company out of New Jersey called Wedgewood Pharmacy, but you need to purchase through a veterinarian
DrHutch: You should breed your bitch on the first cycle after they go off the drug, you do NOT need to skip that cycle
DrHutch: the normal bitch cycles 70 days after you take her off the drug
DrHutch: even though most bitches fall back into their normal cycle be it May and Nov or June and Dec...
DrHutch: and that may effect the timing of her first cycle after coming off the drug
DrHutch: I still think it's one of the greatest drugs we have out there
DrHutch: Even though the bitch's own body produces the progesterone, the progesterone causes inflammation of the uterine lining, and the uterus is never as healthy after a heat cycle as it was before that heat cycle
PHFasDog: The room is set so no one is able to chat in the room right now, except the hosts and the guest.
PHFasDog: If you have trouble or need to be reminded how this works, just doubleclick on my name or the name of any other host with @PH in front of their name, and we will help you!
Question: can Dr. Hutch tell us how safe are cheque drops?
DrHutch: Cheque drops in my mind are one of the safest drugs
DrHutch: we have
DrHutch: side effects include 1 percent tear from the eye
DrHutch: they will get a musky odor
DrHutch: and the most misunderstood side effect is it puts the bitch back into puppy vaginitis again
DrHutch: unfortunately, many vets and breeders alike
DrHutch: interpret any vaginal discharge as pyometritis
DrHutch: Cheque drops actually PREVENT pyometritis
DrHutch: I never hesitate to use this product on my own bitches
Question: What can you tell us about Canine Herpes virus?
DrHutch: Canine herpes virus is part of the kennel cough complex
DrHutch: it is one of the most common viruses our dogs are exposed to
DrHutch: that is why it is so rare to have a problem with the virus
DrHutch: any bitch who has been to a show, a kennel, a training class, probably has herpes virus
DrHutch: and when she has the puppies, she passes the protection to the puppies through the colostrum
DrHutch: and the puppies are now protected
DrHutch: where herpes becomes a problem is in puppies from bitches who have never BEEN exposed to herpes virus
DrHutch: the puppies have no protection and the herpes virus causes an extreme
DrHutch: vasculitis and hemorrhaging throughout the body
DrHutch: and is almost always fatal
DrHutch: Why it does not cause the same problem in an adult dog
DrHutch: is that with a body temperature above 100 degrees
DrHutch: the virus casues only a mild cough
DrHutch: if body temperature is under 100 degrees... and as I'm sure all our breeders know, a newborn puppy's normal temperature is 96 degrees, and a newborn puppy's temperature does not reach 100 degrees until 3-4 weeks of age.. it can be devastating
DrHutch: the treatment is trying to raise the puppy's body temperature to 100 degress
DrHutch: the drugs that are used in humans for herpes are not successful
Question: Is supplementing a pregnant bitch with high doses (2000 mgs a day or more) of Ester C potentially dangerous for either the bitch or the whelps?
DrHutch: Vitamin C is part of the water soluble vitamins, so building up in the body is not a problem
DrHutch: it normally passes out in the urine
DrHutch: it can be a problem supplementing some other vitamins such as A and D, it can cause problems in the puppies
DrHutch: oversupplementation is probably not necessary in this day and age
DrHutch: the bitch also does not require the elevated doses of folic acid that human women require
DrHutch: it is a fallacy that supplementing folic acid stops cleft palates in dogs; cleft palates are primarily a recessive genetic trait
Question: I had a litter of toy pups whelped today, 56th day, weights are 3 to 3.5 ounces (normal is 5-6) and they are not nursing but appear strong.
DrHutch: Always check the puppy's temperatures if they are not nursing
DrHutch: if the temps are below 94 degrees, they should NOT be nursing and you should NOT be tube feeding
DrHutch: puppies who are not nursing, must be monitored... are they gaining weight, losing weight, staying the same, crying, is their coat rough, etc
DrHutch: puppies should not stop nursing
DrHutch: puppies should not stop nursing
DrHutch: but a chilled puppy will stop nursing and should not be supplemented until their temp is back above 96 degrees
DrHutch: please see your veterinarian about these puppies, many things can cause puppies not to eat. Have them examined by your veterinarian.
Question: I have a 5 YO bitch who has had 3 litters. She has been "open" for 3 seasons. I plan to breed her in April. she will be 6 at that time. Any special recommendations for a bitch that age? she has conceived easily all 3 times previous and had healthy litters, we plan a natural breeding.
DrHutch: With her age, it is possible she is starting to get uterine lining changes
DrHutch: you may see a smaller litter because of the thickening of the uterus
DrHutch: she may not be spotting as early as when the bitch was younger
DrHutch: so be CERTAIN to do the progesterone testing to ascertain the exact day of ovulation
DrHutch: once a bitch reaches six years of age her chances of conceiving drop 33 and a third percent
DrHutch: due to nothing more than the progesterone effect on the bitch's uterus over her lifetime
DrHutch: you'll want to be more precise on the timing and breeding than when the bitch was younger
Question: I have a 3 1/2 year old male (Paul) who was recently diagnosed as sterile. His grandsire and great grandsire also went sterile at this age. What is the probability that Paul will pass this to his male offspring?
DrHutch: We have followed numerous breeds, cockers, ESS, English Setters, where the males will be fertile and then
DrHutch: as time goes on the semen count drops until they have no sperm at all
DrHutch: some of these are genetic
DrHutch: and some the genetic part is where we get the body destroying its own sperm cells
DrHutch: I normally work these dogs up and may even do a testicular biopsy
DrHutch: to try to determine what was the cause
DrHutch: was it genetic
DrHutch: and maybe even is it correctible
DrHutch: dogs that lose their sperm is NOT due to thyroid disease, NOT due to bacteria, and is normally something that can go on inside the testicle as opposed to something affecting it from the outside
DrHutch: anytime you get three generations doing the same thing I'd expect it was genetic and could be passed on to the offspring
Question: Lots of questions were submitted on thyroid issues
DrHutch: the thyroid gland has little to do with reproduction
DrHutch: and in male dogs it's been shown that one can totally destroy the male thyroid gland
DrHutch: and have no negative impact on sperm production at all
DrHutch: and in the female
DrHutch: if she comes in season and ovulates, pretty much the thyroid has done all that it needs to do
DrHutch: so low thyroid is not going to cause a bitch to miss
DrHutch: is not going to cause the bitch to resorb puppies
DrHutch: and many of the things that have been attributed to thyroid disease
DrHutch: and suppplementing thyroid medication in an individual who does not need it can down the road
DrHutch: cause them to become hypoythyroid
Question: I plan on taking my bitch to England and having her bred it will be a 8 hr flight would it be better to take her a little earlier so that she settles better so that her cycle will not be affected by the flight etc.
DrHutch: Stress and steroids both can have the same effect, by suppressing
DrHutch: the pituitary activity in the brain
DrHutch: so shipping a bitch for breeding
DrHutch: should be almost a thing of the past
DrHutch: with the advent of fresh cooled and frozen semen
DrHutch: and also with the restrictions by the airlines and increased costs
DrHutch: it is becoming almost prohibitive to ship a bitch
DrHutch: as I say that, especially crossing multiple time zones
DrHutch: if one has to travel or ship a bitch for breeding
DrHutch: the best time to do is the day after her progesterone goes above 5 nanograms
DrHutch: because the bitch cannot UNovulate
DrHutch: breeding her within the next 48 hours should give her the best chance of conception
DrHutch: one of the other mistakes that breeders make is shipping bitches early
DrHutch: with the thought that the bitch is going to suddenly like these people she's never met
DrHutch: when she'd rather be home on the sofa with you watching Oprah
DrHutch: and many times
DrHutch: bitches that are shipped early
DrHutch: bitches that are shipped early
DrHutch: we'll get that phone call from the people on the other end saying hey, why did you ship this bitch, she's not even in season!
DrHutch: many bitches under stress will simply go back out of season without ovulating
DrHutch: think how stressed we get when we're going to travel
DrHutch: and WE want to go!
Question: When is the best time to collect a male?
DrHutch: A male's peak sperm production should be between 2-7 years of age
DrHutch: a male normally has sperm after ten months of age
DrHutch: even though we have successfuly frozen dogs 10-14 years of age
DrHutch: but the younger and healthier a male is when his semen is frozen
DrHutch: the better collection and recovery of the sperm cells
DrHutch: the male does not produce semen seasonally
DrHutch: but there is no doubt that many dogs coming off a hot hot summer do not have the semen quality they do other times of the year
DrHutch: and we need to realize the testicles are outside the body because they need to be COOL
DrHutch: so heat of summer, laying on hot concrete driveways, overuse of hairdryers, and frostbite during the winter
DrHutch: can cause damage to the testicles and their ability to produce sperm
DrHutch: once healthy semen is properly frozen it is usable for probably a thousand years
Question: Dr. Hutch.... I am having a problem with my 2 & 1/2 year old CH. bitch. She had a surgical implant done at your clinic which resulted in 5 puppies, this was her first litter. We did a planned C-section in June. Her last heat cycle was over 6 weeks ago. Everything seemed normal. But about 3 weeks later I noticed a small amount of discharge on her white britches. It looks like old blood.
DrHutch: As long as the discharge isn't persistent, then I probably would not worry about it
DrHutch: it is more than likely just the body cleaning the uterus out
DrHutch: it's not a reason to start her on antibiotics
DrHutch: nor would we have to worry about pyometritis because pyometritis
DrHutch: occurs when the uterus is under the prime effects of progesterone
Question: how does cabergoline work and what specifically does it do?
DrHutch: cabergoline is the new "wonder drug" that we're using to induce bitches into ovulatory heat cycles
DrHutch: the drug is what as known as an anti-prolactin drug
DrHutch: after the bitch ovulates the body maintains the progesterone for two months
DrHutch: it is prolactin that keeps her from cycling right away and is why the bitch's interval between cycles is 6-7 months
DrHutch: since we don't know exactly what makes a bitch come into season
DrHutch: we looked at it from the end of what prevents a bitch from coming into season
DrHutch: by taking out the prolactin, using cabergoline, the bitch will come into a cycle on her own
DrHutch: it is NOT an artificial cycle
DrHutch: we've done nothing to hormonally manipulate it
DrHutch: we've just removed the stopper
DrHutch: cabergoline is an oral product used once a day for 10 days
DrHutch: usually the bitch comes in within 2-3 weeks
DrHutch: it is a very safe drug
DrHutch: with minimal side effects
DrHutch: but it is a human drug
DrHutch: and can be relatively pricey
DrHutch: a couple hundred dollars
DrHutch: it was mentioned in one of the recent AKC Gazettes
DrHutch: it is NOT an experimental drug as was said in the Gazette
DrHutch: where I'm using it is on bitches that have not cycled within 12 months or I'm using it more and more for convenience for my clients to have puppies when they want them
DrHutch: it takes a bitch 4 and a half months for the uterus to get over the previous heat cycle
DrHutch: so we can use cabergoline any time after 4 and a half months since the previous cycle
DrHutch: follow our progesterone
DrHutch: breed her
DrHutch: and expect to have puppies!
DrHutch: it is NOT successful for bringing bitches into a first heat cycle
PHFasDog: The room is set so no one is able to chat in the room right now, except the hosts and the guest. If you have trouble or need to be reminded how this works, just doubleclick on my name or the name of any other host with @PH in front of their name, and we will help you!
Question: do you feel the bovine colostrum they have out in health stores or in the dog catalogs are actually good to give to dogs and puppies to boost their immune system? And would it be helpful for those pups that didn't get mom's colostrum?
DrHutch: Bovine colostrum is not really that useful
DrHutch: because puppies aren't exposed to the same pro
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