| PHFlea: Flea is the name of my dog...not bugs |
| Minuet: Hi Thorn! |
| PHFlea: Hi Mary Welcome!!! |
| Minuet: Hi Mary |
| marys_nr: Hi, thanks |
| PHFlea: How are you tonight?? |
| Minuet: How is everyone tonight? |
| Minuet: GMTA |
| marys_nr: Great |
| PHFlea: Hi Trav!! welcome |
| PHFlea: How are you tonight?? |
| PHFlea: Hi Cateyes!! Welcome |
| Minuet: HI trav |
| Minuet: HI Cat |
| travlinpom_nr: hey all |
| PHFlea: What's new in the Pom world?? |
| PHFlea: Hi Yarnell!! Welcome |
| yarnell_nr: hi everyone |
| Minuet: HI Yarnell |
| PHFlea: How are things going Yarnell?? |
| Minuet: Does everyone here breed? |
| yarnell_nr: yes |
| marys_nr: No, I am not |
| travlinpom_nr: Flea, doing okay thanks |
| travlinpom_nr: Yes |
| PHFlea: Any new puppy breathe out here?? |
| cateyes81_nr: hi all |
| travlinpom_nr: my youngest are five weeks old now |
| yarnell_nr: no but maybe some in the oven LOL |
| cateyes81_nr: everyone here breeders? |
| Minuet: I'm not |
| PHFlea: <------I don't |
| PHFlea: Breeders maybe you can help me, In the future I may be looking for a new pup......... |
| PHFlea: How do I go about finding a good breeder?? |
| travlinpom_nr: Flea, i would start at a dog show . . . you can see lots of dogs and talk to some great breeders |
| cateyes81_nr: PHflea what breed r u looking for |
| PHFlea: I know to avoid newspaper etc........ |
| cateyes81_nr: what kinda dog |
| PHFlea: Cat....not quite sure yet......DH wants another big dog, I personally would like to keep the clan small |
| cateyes81_nr: I dont know if dog shows are always good you dont wnana end up with someone who ONLy breeds for conformation |
| PHFlea: Hi RR!! Welcome |
| PHKiwi: Hi Flea |
| PHKiwi: how you be |
| PHFlea: Hi Kiwi!!! |
| travlinpom_nr: Flea, you could also check the website for the National Club (whichever breed you are looking for), they usually have a list of members |
| Minuet: Hi RR |
| Minuet: HI Kiwi |
| travlinpom_nr: cate, that is what they should be breeding for!! |
| PHFlea: Trav that's good to know!! |
| yarnell_nr: i would contact theNational club for the breed you want and ask for a reputable breeders |
| PHFlea: Is there specific questions I should ask the breeders?? |
| yarnell_nr: i would also talk to more than one breeder |
| PHKiwi: Hi all |
| travlinpom_nr: FLea, TONS of questions!! LOL . . . how long they have been breeding/showing, why they bred this litter, do they have references, etc |
| yarnell_nr: health problems for that breed and temperment and references |
| rr_nr: lets hear about the trials and tribulations of breeding ;) |
| travlinpom_nr: I agree with Yarnell, talk to several breeders |
| rr_nr: we have a female that just had a split cycle... |
| Minuet: Hi Rue! |
| PHFlea: Trav, being that I have a pom, and you know poms........knowing that there litters are so small, should I go on a waiting list somewhere?? |
| PHFlea: Hi Rue!!! |
| travlinpom_nr: and run very fast in the other direction if they tell you that they have NO health problems |
| rr_nr: thought we had her bred and then she went right back into heat |
| yarnell_nr: wait three or four weeks and she should be back in season |
| rr_nr: we've never had this happen...kind of freaked us out |
| travlinpom_nr: Flea, well possibly . . . most small breeders dont use a waiting list, the larger breeders do . . . better idea is to start talking to breeders now and get to know them, they will pick the best home regardless of a wait list |
| PHFlea: Oh that's good to know!!! |
| rr_nr: i agree |
| yarnell_nr: this just happened to my girl we thought she was out and then we saw color again put the male with her and he was very happy and she was very willing so we bred them |
| travlinpom_nr: Flea, i always tell folks to just stay in touch and i'll let them know when i have something available, i figure if they dont stay in touch, they didnt really want one of mine |
| rr_nr: yarnell, our female is very dominant even to the males |
| rr_nr: we are having trouble with her chasing the boys off |
| yarnell_nr: my hardest part in breeding is to get a natural tie. Trying to get two Saint together is a job lol |
| rr_nr: i bet[img id=em-5] |
| travlinpom_nr: yarnell, LOL, what a picture!!! geez, i can sit on the floor with both of mine and hold them together |
| PHFlea: Hi Deerhounds...Welcome to Breeders Chat!! |
| yarnell_nr: then when you do get a tie someone wants to lay down |
| Deerhounds: Hello hello! |
| rr_nr: although we work up a sweat with our giants |
| PHFlea: <-------trying to picture Trav holding to poms on the floor doing the wild thing |
| Deerhounds: ROFLMAO, I picked a good moment to come in.... |
| rr_nr: if we had a mutt we did not want bred she's be throwing litters unter the pick up truck |
| yarnell_nr: people just don't know what we go through |
| Deerhounds: LOL rr |
| travlinpom_nr: Flea, really not too hard with poms, one hand under the girl to hold vulva and keep her steady, other hand ready to catch boy from the rear when he ties |
| rr_nr: amen [img id=em-6] |
| cateyes81_nr: travilingpom just curious what are poms bred for |
| Deerhounds: folks, I'm going to change into my hosting name as Morgan isn't here, brb as PHChristy |
| rr_nr: it is when the female intimidates the heck out of the stud |
| travlinpom_nr: cateyes, they are a companion dog |
| PHFlea: Hi Po!! Welcome to Breeders Chat |
| yarnell_nr: i have used a breeding rack and it is so much easier |
| PoLow_nr: Hello and Thank you! |
| PHFlea: Yarnell...what is a breeding rack for us non breeders |
| rr_nr: we are still all hands on |
| yarnell_nr: how many of you have collected your male |
| rr_nr: nope |
| travlinpom_nr: I have . . . he thought i was nuts |
| rr_nr: i bet he loved you a lot though |
| yarnell_nr: a breeding rack is where you can tie the bitch in so that you can help the male and there is also no lweight put on the bitch. Some of the males are over 200 lbs |
| rr_nr: a friend of ours used to do that often and the studs just loved to see her |
| PHFlea: Yarnell what do you have for a breed again?? |
| travlinpom_nr: I rarely do AI's, so this was quite an experience!!! lol |
| yarnell_nr: saints |
| PHFlea: Yarnell....I have a friend who breeds Saints, she does collection...... |
| rr_nr: breeding is not for the faint at heart |
| cateyes81_nr: i love saints |
| yarnell_nr: thanks cateyes |
| PHFlea: Hi Christy...WELCOME!! |
| travlinpom_nr: yarnell, i knew an old time breeder that used a rack for poms . . . i still dont see the purpose to it, they are small enough to hold |
| rr_nr: gotta go for now, I will try to log back in later |
| PHChristy: Hi all, I"m back! |
| cateyes81_nr: yarnell r u a saint breeder |
| travlinpom_nr: yarnell, i DEFINATELY see the purpose in using them with a Saint!! |
| PHChristy: by rr |
| yarnell_nr: yes |
| PHChristy: I have never quite liked the idea of a rack |
| PHFlea: Night RR |
| PHChristy: I want to breed dogs who can do the deed |
| PHChristy: I will be somewhat forgiving for first timers, but it's best if they can do it unassisted IMO |
| cateyes81_nr: yarnell to breed saints do they require any titles first? to be a good breeder? |
| yarnell_nr: so do i but sometimes that just does not happen in saints |
| travlinpom_nr: Christy, i dont use them, so i am just guessing, but i thought it was for the safety and comfort of the bitch, no pressure on legs and back, etc |
| yarnell_nr: i like them to have a title first |
| PHChristy: cateyes, I believe that all breeds of dog need to have some sort of objective test of their worth, before breeding... be it show titles or working titles or some other similar achievement |
| PHChristy: Pom, hmmm, perhaps that's the case |
| cateyes81_nr: yarnell what titles do saints usually get? |
| PHChristy: I do know one deerhound breeder who bred a bitch who had once had a broken leg and was a bit lame, she did have trouble being bred because of that |
| travlinpom_nr: Christy, but dont believe me . . . I have toys!!! lol |
| yarnell_nr: ch |
| PHChristy: and yet it wasn't genetic in any way |
| PHChristy: LOL Pom |
| cateyes81_nr: PH would deerhounds usually get tracking titles? |
| PHChristy: cateyes, there are some that have, but no, for us it would be show or racing or coursing titles that would count |
| PHChristy: but we don't have a field/show split in our breed, so the dogs tend to have show titles, not just coursing or racing, if they are bred |
| PHChristy: no one is breeding deerhounds just for the field |
| cateyes81_nr: do you think its ok to breed if you JUSt have a conformation title? |
| PHChristy: but in some breeds, they do - especially hunting breeds |
| PHChristy: cateyes, yes, in my breed it's ok with me, but I would PREFER the dogs have some kind of performance title also. However, in some parts of the country that's unrealistic |
| yarnell_nr: no there are many other factors thaat come into to play |
| PHFlea: Hi Kathy!! Welcome |
| travlinpom_nr: cateyes, in many breeds, the conformation title is the most important, and in some breeds, it is the ONLY valuable title |
| PHChristy: Hi kathy! welcome to Dog Breeding Chat! |
| PHChristy: Yes, what pom said! |
| kathy_nr: Hi ty for the welcome |
| yarnell_nr: there are many dogs out there with ch title that should not have one |
| PHChristy: I should say, in some parts of the WORLD that's unrealistic |
| cateyes81_nr: oh like GSD's i think conformation means very little |
| PHChristy: LOL yarnell, yes, that's a problem too, but still, I'd rather have it than NOT have it |
| PHChristy: If I were getting a GSD I would prefer not to get one from US show lines |
| PHChristy: an AKC conformation title would actually be a negative for me |
| marys_nr: Why is that? |
| travlinpom_nr: yarnell, i agree, and i think that happens in all breeds . . . many many poms that shouldnt have even finished are out there specialitng |
| PHChristy: however, the concept of some kind of objective testing of the breeding program is the important issue for me |
| PHChristy: marys, just personal preference. I don't care for the GSD as currently being shown in AKC |
| kathy_nr: i think many dog clubs struggle with that issue |
| PHChristy: however, I don't own GSDs so it's just an observation of my personal preference |
| yarnell_nr: i am a owner handler and I finish my dogs therefor a ch means a lot to me |
| PHChristy: if someone is breeding herding dogs who actually HERD, then I don't give a hoot about their show titles |
| cateyes81_nr: oh why arnet u into show gsd's PHchristy? |
| PHChristy: cateyes, well, first of all it's not my breed, but I find them too weedy looking, I don't care for the topline, and I don't like the rear angulation or the way they walk on their hocks |
| cateyes81_nr: PHchristy what about show dobermans and rotties |
| travlinpom_nr: Every breeder has to be breeding with a greater pupose, not just cranking out puppies, titles are a good indication that the dogs are achieving something . . it is not the only indicator |
| travlinpom_nr: did that make sense? |
| PHChristy: but if someone is breeding dogs who don't do any work, then I want to see them doing something to prove their breeding program, and that is usually conformation showing |
| marys_nr: They are extreme. I don't like those characteristics either |
| PHChristy: Yes, Pom, it made perfect sense |
| PHChristy: marys, but if that is what American fanciers want, then that's ok with me. I just would not want a dog of those lines |
| PHChristy: personally |
| cateyes81_nr: me neither |
| PHChristy: cateyes, I like AKC rotties and Dobies fine, conformationally speaking |
| cateyes81_nr: i think working titles mean most |
| PHChristy: I've been told that the Rotties have "too soft" of personalities, not sure abou tthat |
| PHChristy: cateyes, well, not for Pomeranians |
| PHChristy: it all depends on the breed |
| PHFlea: Christy....ummmm makes you wonder..... |
| PHChristy: and also, there is another issue that I think does matter, and that is wha tmakes a breed, a breed? |
| cateyes81_nr: i would never want to get a show rottie or doberman if they dont have working titles in schH since thats a big part of their breed is to protect |
| travlinpom_nr: Exactly . . . we have lots of poms with obed/agility/tracking titles, but poms were not bred to track . . . they are companions, so conformation is the very best way to prove what you have in Poms |
| PHChristy: If I had a dog who could herd sheep all day long, but it was 129 pounds and had a long, white, fluffy coat and a coarse head and a flat, wide tail, would that make it a Border Collie? |
| cateyes81_nr: Phchristy shouldnt the characterstics and what the dog can do make a breed a breed |
| PHChristy: if a dog can do the work but doesn't resemble the breed at all, does that matter? |
| travlinpom_nr: "type" defines a breed |
| cateyes81_nr: oh i agree with u deehound |
| PHChristy: I think that ideally, what makes the breed the breed, is contained in the standard |
| PHChristy: however, some standards are better than others |
| PHChristy: OMG, we got off topic! |
| PHChristy: and I'm in charge, LOL! |
| cateyes81_nr: ive seen some working german shepherds that look more like rotties its very silly |
| travlinpom_nr: we had a topic??? |
| PHChristy: our topic tonight is "Getting it Done!" |
| PHChristy: LOL, yes, we did! |
| PHChristy: "Getting It Done: Tips on ACTUAL Breeding" |
| travlinpom_nr: that will teach me not to come in late . . . . |
| cateyes81_nr: POm so a non working dog like a pom would requre CD CGC titles? |
| PHChristy: what drives me most insane is the period when the bitch is the most flirtatious but the stud wont' breed her |
| yarnell_nr: how many of you do timing test |
| PHChristy: experience has taught me she's not ready, just trying to drive him insane |
| travlinpom_nr: cateyes, no they would not "require" any title other than champion, but those titles are nice "extras" |
| PHChristy: yarnell, I am going to do it next time, but I haven't had a litter in 4 years, since I first heard about it |
| cateyes81_nr: ohhh ic |
| PHChristy: but I do like to let the bitch and stud be together as much as they want over the whole period of her heat, and letting them figure it out |
| travlinpom_nr: timing test: my old boy "Asa" . . . . he ALWAYS knows!! lol |
| PHChristy: however, that is easier said than done, ROFL |
| PHChristy: my last breeding I felt that way too but I still ended up at the vet doing a fresh AI.... two days later the bitch and dog started doing natural breedings and didn't stop until day 19 |
| travlinpom_nr: Actual breedings here are very very supervised . . . the girls never run with the boys, i hold the girl for breeding |
| PHChristy: I used to have a stud dog who was very good at it, but he had the feeling that all bitches were always ready - but he never missed, not once |
| yarnell_nr: with my breed i can't leave them that long together i would be afaird of bloat |
| PHChristy: if he ejaculated in the same ROOM as the bitch, she conceived |
| PHChristy: yarnell, how so? |
| PHChristy: Pom, why is that? Fear of injuries? |
| PHChristy: Mine are always supervised |
| PHChristy: but I like them to figure out the breeding part by themselves |
| PHChristy: which is, of course, why I end up in the snow at 3 AM, for a half hour tie |
| travlinpom_nr: Christy, Asa is my proof . . . i have boys that will breed anything, anytime . . . but Asa wont waste his time . . . he sniffs and walks away if they arent ready |
| yarnell_nr: the male would be pacing trying to breed drinking lots of water |
| travlinpom_nr: Christy, yes fear of injury to the bitch or the stud |
| travlinpom_nr: Christy, they breed naturally, but i hold the girl |
| PHChristy: well, it is difficult.... I don't want to stop people who have very extreme breeds such as Saints or bulldogs from not having their breeds, and I realize that they have some limitations. But I prefer a breed that is more natural, that can breed on their own and whelp on their own most of the time |
| PHChristy: and I want to perpetuate dogs who have a good instinct and libido and ability |
| PHChristy: sex maniacs |
| PHChristy: I think it's very healthy for a breed |
| PHChristy: but again, I realize I have a very natural breed |
| PHChristy: and not everyone does |
| PHChristy: PoLow, is your breed Polish Lowland Sheepdogs? |
| PoLow_nr: Yes it is. |
| travlinpom_nr: Christy, i dont want you to misunderstand, my dogs do their own breeding but i support the bitch and in most cases, i hold the rear of the boy once he ties for balance |
| Foxbridge_nr: Hey guys |
| PoLow_nr: We have only been in the breed for 2 years though |
| Foxbridge_nr: Long time ,,,,no see |
| Foxbridge_nr: HI Pom!!!! |
| travlinpom_nr: Hey Fox!!! |
| PHFlea: HI Fox and Dorothy!!! |
| PHChristy: Hi there Fox and Dorothy! Welcome to Dog Breeding Chat! |
| PHChristy: PoLow, do they breed pretty naturally? I would think they would |
| PoLow_nr: Lots of time needs to pass before we consider breeding. |
| PHFlea: wb mary |
| PHChristy: WB Marys! |
| Foxbridge_nr: i bet you guys forgot about me ??[img id=em-0] |
| Dorothy_nr: Hello, should be interesting |
| travlinpom_nr: Fox, they keep promising me a "pom" avitar . . . but so far . . . nothing ((big hint to Christy)) LOL |
| marys_nr: oops, got kicked off accidentally. |
| PoLow_nr: Others that we know of seem to be about 50 -50. |
| PHFlea: <--------trav I agree!! |
| PHChristy: LOL Foxbridge, nevah!! how have you been? |
| Dorothy_nr: I'd like to say I've never had trouble getting dogs bred: can I help? |
| Foxbridge_nr: I've been busy...had to go get a job |
| PHChristy: Pom, I did send it in! I swear! |
| Foxbridge_nr: yuck..i have to work till 9 at night now |
| PHChristy: yuck! |
| PHChristy: jobs ick |
| PHFlea: Fox.......me too!! officially unemployed |
| travlinpom_nr: Flea, she promised me she would use my CH Asa's headshot . . . but nooooooooooooo |
| PHChristy: LOL |
| PHChristy: PHSplendens did make the avatar |
| PHFlea: not unemployed I mean |
| PHChristy: and then I sent it in to Clint |
| travlinpom_nr: Dorothy, what do you breed? |
| PHChristy: I'm sure it will appear very soon! |
| Foxbridge_nr: guess what?,,,,,My Ibizan bitch took BOB the last show guys!! |
| PHChristy: OMG, congratulations! |
| travlinpom_nr: Christy, where do i find it?? |
| PHFlea: WTG!!! |
| PHChristy: Pom, it will just appear when he puts it in |
| PHChristy: I did that one, a Shih Tzu for Cackle, and some new horses and fish |
| PoLow_nr: COMGRATULATIONS Foxbridge |
| Dorothy_nr: I've raised Mini Schnauzers, Lhasas and Yorkies, but have helped many others with breedings |
| travlinpom_nr: Fox, WAY TO GO!!!!! |
| PHFlea: Hi Morgan!!! |
| PHMorgan: Haroo |
| Foxbridge_nr: thanks guyus,.it was fun..first time to win that |
| PHMorgan: Apparently I didn't pray hard enough to the internet gods this week |
| PHChristy: Morgan!!! |
| PHMorgan: Hi! |
| PHChristy: LOL Morgan, I'm just glad you are here |
| PHMorgan: Sorry I'm late |
| PHMorgan: Computer and AOL not cooperating AT ALL |
| PHMorgan: So? WhadidImiss? |
| PHChristy: we have been discussing "Getting it Done"\ |
| travlinpom_nr: Morgan, all they want to talk about is sex . . . geez . . . . lol |
| PHChristy: WB Dorothy! |
| PHChristy: ROFL Pom |
| Foxbridge_nr: getting what done? |
| PHChristy: we did veer off once or twice |
| Dorothy_nr: lol, got kicked off |
| travlinpom_nr: It was Christy's fault . . . . |
| PHChristy: Foxbridge, tonight's topic is "Getting It Done: Tips on ACTUAL Breeding" |
| PHMorgan: So - did we discuss stud dogs who won't cooperate? |
| Foxbridge_nr: Ohhhhhh |
| PHChristy: Morgan, somewhat |
| Foxbridge_nr: ok..I'm with ya now |
| travlinpom_nr: <<--- knows how to cover her Beeehind |
| PHChristy: we discussed stud dogs who ignore bitches who act like they are ready but aren't |
