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DogHobbyist.com
Steve Dale
Fighting Breed Specific Legislation
February 26, 2006

PHChristy: I'm Christie Keith, the editor of PetHobbyist.com. Before we begin, all of us at PetHobbyist would like to mention that this year's Chat Week on DogHobbyist.com is dedicated to the memory of Kelly Coughlin, PHFrolic. Kelly was a part of our family and she will be much missed by all of us.

PHChristy: And now, on behalf of all of us at DogHobbyist.com, let me welcome you to our special guest chat with Steve Dale on the topic of fighting breed specific legislation.

PHChristy: Most members of the media not only don't help stem the hysteria over dog breeds that leads to breed-specific legislation, they egg it on.

PHChristy: In marked contrast is Steve Dale, the country's most popular syndicated pet columnist and radio show host, who has for years been an outspoken opponent of BSL. As Steve recently wrote, "Ironic - the winner at Westminster is banned from some cities. My message is 'you can make a difference, you must!' One thing in common in all cities with BSL - apathy."

PHChristy: We will open the chat with comments from Steve, and then take your questions and comments. If you have a question or comment at any time during the chat, please type a ? or ! and then wait to be called on by PHSmDog. Please don't talk in the room during this special chat.

PHChristy: Thank you very much for being here with us tonight, Steve - would you like to say a few words to begin?

SteveDale: I was typing to everyone - what does it mean to say 'I whispered?' I speak loud.

PHChristy: LOL STeve, it means you had someone's name highlighted so it only went to that person, you'll have to send it again

PHChristy: if you accidentally highlight someone's name, you can just move the highlight to your own name and it will go to the whole room

PHChristy: but the default is to go to the whole room

SteveDale: Ooops. Sorry. I said...I'm sure the people here care. What I meant by apathy isn't that people don't care, so much as they don't act. I'm screaming - no more whispering.

SteveDale: The idea is to also be proactive, before something happens in your community...if and when it does happen - take action....I'm working on two things:

SteveDale: First stopping BSL here....and if we are successful, I'm taking careful note of how we're doing it. The hope is create a model for other cities. It all starts with

EmilyS_nr: ?as a journalist, how would you suggest we respond to hysteria and misinformation in news stories?

SteveDale: NOT solely focusing on dogs...but on public safety. That is how I suggest this issue be framed to the media, to the public, to the politicians. . . My co-chair here is a wonderful woman, a go getter of great intellegence. I chose her not because she's on the commission of animal control, but because she doesn't even have a dog!

EmilyS_nr: whoops! sorry

SteveDale: Em - Take control of the situation and organize and get the message, your points across to the media.

SteveDale: oidipa;

SteveDale: Oooops - my cat Roxy just type that. Sorry.

jefarm_nr: Hi Steve Jeff here...and Ditto on not even owning a dog..But after Ryan was attacked and nothing happned I could not sit back and watch another child get mauled.

PHChristy: Folks, please hold your comments and questions

PHChristy: until you are called on

PHChristy: thanks

SteveDale: I know you. Ladies and gentleman, Jeff Armstrong. Jeff, should explain your story. It's compelling friends. We're luck to have Jeff in Illinois. But he helps others all over.

SteveDale: Are you all waiting for me?

PHChristy: Yes, Steve

PHChristy: when you're done just type GA so we know

PHChristy: that means go ahead

SteveDale: GA -

PHChristy: same when you answer a question

SteveDale: whatever that means...Unless you want me to say more.

PHChristy: no, that's fine...

PHChristy: we were just being polite

spacegirl_nr: ?

PHSmDog: Spacegirl...ga

spacegirl_nr: do you think that offering dog safety programs in schools would help?

PHChristy: folks, if you have a question or comment, type a ? or ! and we'll add you to the queue... wait for PHSmDog to call on you

SteveDale: Absolutely yes. And absolutely no. I will explain.

Valkyrie: ?

PHFaust: ?

SteveDale: Certainly education is HUGE. And not only educating kids, but adults too....What I really worry is an entire culture growing up who's only experience with dogs are fighting dogs...They never, ever experience a wet dog kiss.

staffordmom: ?

SteveDale: What's more all this impacts our society - desensitizing kids to violence at a young age...Reaching adults too.....here's why

SteveDale: Tethering dogs is linking to fatal/serious attacks...according to the CDC, AVMA - and I can cite the people who have researched this...Now, we have to communicate these things to the public.

PHSmDog: Next up in the que is Valkyrie, followed by PHFaust and Staffordmom

SteveDale: The assumption is that the public wants BSL. Not true, according to polls...But educate the public before you take the polls. Do I type the I'm finished letters after any post? Sorry, I'm such a novice at this.

PHSmDog: Valkyrie GA

Valkyrie: In Auburn, WA last week, an existing law has been changed to be breed specific. What it says, in a nutshell is that if you have a dog from the list or a dog that looks like one of the listed breeds it must be registered as "potentially dangerous". Once the dog has bitten it will then be deemed dangerous.

Valkyrie: It is still a breed specific law, but do you feel this is an acceptable alternative to outright banning breeds? GA

SteveDale: In my view ANY law that target ANY breed as different is specific and unecessary.

PHSmDog: PHFaust GA

SteveDale: In Illilnois State Rep. Mike Boland is attempting to legislate a law to potentially create a Class 4 Felony for the person who's dog it is that attacks. Any dog, any breed. I think that's fine...We should be resopnsible for our kids, four legged ones too. GA

PHFaust: Steve, Love ya babe, hope to see ya at reptile fest in a few short weeks. My question is where in IL do you feel is the most effective place to focus right now with BSL proposals hitting everywhere. And what do you feel is our best approach thru CBBR.

SteveDale: We'll publish ours if it works. And Jeff Armstrong is a major part of that, and has been in IL and I see him here....It's about creating a coalition...getting experts on dogs together to deal issues and offer alternatives.

SteveDale: And who are you ? A reptile person, apparently. GA

Lyssa_nr: ?

jefarm_nr: !

spacegirl_nr: ?

PHFaust: One of the Iguana Squad... I actually Owned the parents of your BTS

PHFaust: The last of the breeding pair passed away this summer

PHFaust: GA

SteveDale: Too bad the Am Staff person logged out...Interesting to me...and this is how Christie bgan that ...here are dogs now that may win Westminster - and now David Frei can't take them to certain cities.

Karen_nr: Steve , I myself have found working against bsl in Illinois that we need to educate the legislators regarding Code of Ethics breeders and show people, and also about back yard breeders and puppy mills. These bsl laws are going to drive the reputable breeders out of breeding, and the people that are not registering their dogs will fly under the radar . I have found that some legislators did not even know that we cannot spay and neuter our conformation show dogs, LIKE RUFUS, who just won Westminster. Also some of our small towns in northern Illinois are just attempting to ban pits and pit like dogs (phsycial profiling) . For us, and you know about it, we are getting bigger and bigger groups of people organized to email and fax the council people and trustees. Seems to be working.

SteveDale: Like the Academy Award going to a movie that can't be screen where you live.

Karen_nr: oops..sorry I pushed the wrong button.

PHAbymom: ?

PHBlackBear: If you have a question for Steve, please type a "?" in the room and you will be added to the queue. You will be called on in the order of "?". Please do not type openly in the chat room. Thank you for coming!

PHSmDog: Staffordmom GA

staffordmom: If you hear about BSL in your community, what is the best way to start fighting it?

SteveDale: Well, you know politcians are mostly trying to repond to constituents...or what they think they want. Some know something about dogs, many don't...They're mostly trying to do the right thing. Others are trying to get public attention. GA

PHSmDog: Staffordmom, could you restate the question please?

SteveDale: Staffordmom - Ideally, I think the best way is before you hear. But to answer what you ask - get EVERYONE together, bring in the vets, the ASPCA, HSUS, if there's a dog trainer group or shelter organization...or for a smaller town, just a prominent dog trainer and a exec director or knowledgeable shelter person...even people involved in education or child welfare. . . People all on the same page...People with fancy letters after their name and with prestige to come up with a better way. GA

staffordmom: If you hear about BSL happening in your community what is the best way to start fighting it?

PHChristy: ok I think we got that one already, thanks Staffordmom ....

PHChristy: who is next, SmDog?

PHSmDog: Next up is Lyssa

Lyssa_nr: I'm in an area without any proposed BSL, but what could I do in my area to stave it off? to be proactive as you suggested?

Lyssa_nr: ga

SteveDale: Always, doing something having folks contact politicians - getting people together on the Net to do that is hugely important. GA

PHSmDog: Jefarm GA

jefarm_nr: PAIDO ( Parents Against Irresponsible Dog Owners) is helping organize, and now may be expanding to Missouri to help fight BSL there. And as Steve mentioned The Ryan Armstrong Law in Illinois, has been a model for many cities, and towns. Becasue it prohibits breed profiling and any restrictions. Its all dogs period..GA

PHChristy: I love that ... against irresponsible DOG OWNERS

SteveDale: Lyssa - This is huge - and I'm limited for space in all this...and more will ultimately be written. But first identify potential concerns...Say, stray dogs and dog fighting...whatever they are - and they vary on the community, and try to organize a group of experts to add to the animal control act to address them...Also get to know the people involved in the animal legislation where you are. GA

PHSmDog: Spacegirl GA

spacegirl_nr: how do you find out exactly what bsl or proposed bsl exists in your area?

SteveDale: Once it's proposed, it usually makes the news. You'll know it in most places GA

PHChristy: ?

PHSmDog: PHAbymom GA

SteveDale: And it usually happens in response to something, say an attack . . . and that attack makes the news necessitating the response...or at least that's how the politciians perceive. GA

SteveDale: The messages are:

SteveDale: Get involved....and get other experts involved, organize...and take control of the issue. GA

SteveDale: Are you all whispering? Or am I takling too much?

PHSmDog: PHAbymom is up next

PHAbymom: How do we counter existing legislation, such as those states that have banned hybrid anything... there by outlawing Bengal and Savannah cat breeds.

SteveDale: I love this question...For a TON of reasons.

nicol_nr: hello everybody

SteveDale: First, for an enormous number of people who say 'I have a Calavier King Charles spaniel, what do I care?' or 'I have a cat, what do I care?'

nicol_nr: can somebody help me with a puppy question

SteveDale: This is legislative epidemic going on - and decision made by - instead of educated pet people and vets- and let me say that again I feel SO STRONGLY - veterinarians need to be involved...the decision are made - well meaning or not - by people who have no clue.

SteveDale: If BSL had hapened her with pits, I know Rotties were next on her list...and what after? And you're right about the cat breeds, and really the same answers applies. The real challenge, and problem comes when the laws are passed....Like Denver. . . Far easier to prevent than to over-rule. GA

PHSmDog: PHChristy GA

PHChristy: how about US getting in there and proposing good or model NON breed specific legislation in our areas? trying to find a legislator to propose something?

PHChristy: ga

PHChristy: Folks, if you have a question or comment for Steve or about BSL, please type ? or ! and we'll add you to the queue. :)

SteveDale: I will be talking to a senator about U.S. national legislation. I'm not sure it could be done though...Lots of issues beyond my understanding about state controls. I will be talking with Wayne Pacelle more about this - we've already chatted on this...No matter how you feel about the HSUS, they are steadfast against BSL. They've been VERY helpful. Even more here in IL, the ASPCA. Brilliant. The ASPCA taught me to use the 'P' word if I need to pull out a secret weapon. GP.

SteveDale: Or is that GA?

RedDog_nr: ?

PHSmDog: RedDog GA

RedDog_nr: Steve, are you aware of newly proposed legislation in California about greyhounds?

SteveDale: NO -

RedDog_nr: there was a TV news channel that showed footage of some greyhounds coursing jackrabbits in an agricultural area and it's led to proposed legislation that has a lot of language in it borrowed from other BSL

RedDog_nr: it is VERY troubling

RedDog_nr: AB 2110 is the bill

SteveDale: I don't understand. No greyhounds? I can't fathom. GD

Valkyrie: ?

PHBlackBear: ?

RedDog_nr: that greyhounds aren't "safe" to live near because they might kill a jackrabbit

RedDog_nr: it's very scary

SteveDale: I still don't understand. But what are they proposing? No greyhounds because they may kill rabbits.....

RedDog_nr: this is why we have to realize that BSL is a slippery slope and they'll get ALL our dogs one day if they can

RedDog_nr: ga

RedDog_nr: that a greyhound who kills a jackrabbit be deemed a dangerous dog

RedDog_nr: or kills anything

RedDog_nr: dangerous to HUMANS

RedDog_nr: it's using part of the code about fighting dogs, and some language from the hunting code... it's a terrible law

SteveDale: I agree about the slipperly slope, of course...that's what I've been saying. But I most don't speak up until it's too late.

RedDog_nr: well, I would say that most sighthound people never saw this one coming

RedDog_nr: based on how shocked everyone is

RedDog_nr: which is why I, as a pitbull owner, have to say... YOUR BREED MAY BE NEXT

RedDog_nr: thank you for what you do, Steve.

PHBlackBear: -?

RedDog_nr: ga

PHSmDog: Next in the que is Valkyrie followed by PHBlackBear

SteveDale: Call me dense - I still don't get it. Greyhounds are dangerous to humans 'cause they kill rabbits. Is that the suggestion? If so - you can jump on this or someone who lives in CA. Find a veterinary behaviorists out there and begin to refute this as absurd. Tell the truth about what greyhounds are, and who knows, rescues may go up. I am happy to contact the author of this as well. I just can't believe it. I never call politcians stupid. But . . .

SteveDale: GD or GA or whatever....

PHSmDog: Valkyrie GA

PHChristy: Steve, I know about it as I also live in CA and have sighthounds, I will email you more info if RedDog doesn't.

PHAbymom: !

Valkyrie: I'm a vet tech, you have said that veterinarians are valuable in the fight against BSLs would a technician be of any value? GA

SteveDale: Please. I do want to know more. Okay - see what you've done Chrsity (I think I incorerctly spelled your name earilier - if so - sorry)....I will be writing about this - if true. I still can't believe....

SteveDale: Was that Dr. Susan Little?

PHChristy: Yes, I think that was Dr. Little

PHChristy: she is going to be our guest later in the week on CatHobbyist

PHAbymom: She's doing a chat for us Thursday evening

SteveDale: Absolutely - vet techs are hands on with dogs as much as anyone. There's a group of vet techs with expertise in behavior. What a terrific person that would be to sit at the table with the other experts....

SteveDale: Oh my Gosh - I love her. When she comes back on Thursday, be sure to ask about her Emu research.

SteveDale: She is seriously brilliant. . .

spacegirl_nr: ?

PHSmDog: PHBlackBear GA

SteveDale: Am I supposed to say more?

PHChristy: no, Steve, we are waiting for the next question :)

PHBlackBear: my question was answered, I was asking about the connection with the greyhounds and what Steve said about first Pits, then Rotts, then who knows .. . so all dog owners should be involved

SteveDale: If Jeff is still here - his story is compelling. . .

PHChristy: Jeff just logged out

PHChristy: Steve, can you tell us Jeff's story since he's gone?

PHSmDog: Ok PHAbymom is up next, followed by Spacegirl

SteveDale: I don't quite understand the greyhound story...I just can't believe anyone could think they're a threat...but that's my point!!! It's starts with one breed - for no reason...Listen if there was really data out there to indicate any breed was dangerous...but there isn't.

PHAbymom: Is some of the BSL carried to the legistlators by the "animal rights" groups who belive that no one should have animals in their homes, the ones that want all the animals turned loose to run in packs and be truly uncontrollable?

SteveDale: By the way, I so recommend "Dogs Bite But Baloons and Slippers Are More Dangerous" by Janis Bradley

PHChristy: Sounds great

SteveDale: I don't know - there have been rumors. Certainly, I do know PeTA thinks BSL is good. And in some towns they're actively been involved to encourage those types of laws.

SteveDale: Is anyone there? Or are you all watching Olympic closing ceremonies?

PHChristy: Steve, you didn't type GA

PHAbymom: Thank you, you confirmed what I've been hearing

SteveDale: GA or GD or whatever.....

PHSmDog: Space Girl GA

PHChristy: we were just waiting on you ;)

spacegirl_nr: you say vets and techs are beneficial in the fight against bsl...what about groomers? there's no degree, but we're hands-on with lots of breeds all the time.

SteveDale: No argument, Spacegirl.

PHSmDog: :-)

SteveDale: ooops - forgot GD

harvbeck: ?

PHSmDog: Harvbeck GA

harvbeck: What about ins. com. are they backing BSL

SteveDale: Oh - I've whispered to - it's GA. What is GA, aside from a great state?

SteveDale: Oh

PHAbymom: Go ahead :-)

SteveDale: I don't know what Ins. com is? you mean the insurance industry?

harvbeck: tes

SteveDale: GA

harvbeck: yes

PHSmDog: He said that he didn't disagree with her... :-)

PHChristy: Everyone, I'm afraid that's all we have time for - I'd like to thank Steve Dale for being our guest, and extend a warm invitation for him to come back again... this was terrific! Thank you, and thanks to all of you for coming tonight!

SteveDale: Complicated answer...I don't know that they're encouraging BSL so much as responding to it. Often a sum of enormous dollars is mandated - that people can't afford...A defact ban.

SteveDale: Before everoyne leaves -

SteveDale: A story on this is indeed at petworldradio.net and also comment on my . wgnradio.com blog

SteveDale: I receive comments on BSL from all around the world....and from cities who have BSL including Denver.

PHChristy: I will include links to those sites in the transcript

SteveDale: Thanks!

Rouen: are we free to thank?

SteveDale: GA -

PHChristy: yes, Rouen, no problem!

PHChristy: thank YOU, Steve, it was wonderful!

Rouen: Thanks for stopping by Steve

PHBlackBear: thanks Steve

Midask9: thank you Steve!!!

SteveDale: See now I've got it - and I think it's over....

spacegirl_nr: thank you, steve.

susankb: thank you Steve, alot to think about --and Elvis is leaving the building with me!

PHChristy: LOL Steve, well next time you'll be an old pro

Skaket: Very interesting and thank you.

PHFaust: Thanks Steve

SteveDale: I hope I was in some way helpful or made some sort of difference....

SteveDale: GA

PHAbymom: Very informative...

PHChristy: Steve, I think you can count on it. :)

PHChristy: and I'll send you the information on that proposal in CA

Valkyrie: You have no idea how much of a difference.

chloe_nr: thanks Steve

PHAbymom: And to answer Harvbeck... many insurance companies are excluding coverage for dog related claims

SteveDale: Well, thanks friends. Christy this is a terrific service. I am happy to do this anytime! And to all of you - you can all matter - I really believe that. Have a good night. GA